2013 1LT - Complete Mechanical Failure

[nullcoding@gmail.com 3]

I have owned (and quite enjoyed) my 2013 Spark (1LT auto) for the last year and a half. Since driving it off the lot, I'd had no major problems whatsoever. Granted, I don't do as much driving as most here - it currently sits at 18179 lifetime miles - but now, that number's not going any higher.

On the 10th of this month, I was involved in a three-car collision on a twisty road (around a relatively blind curve). I should mention this is a road I've driven countless times for many years. I know the roads around here very, very well, and of course I was going the speed limit as that's plenty fast for a curvy back road!

As I went to go round a corner, the car gave up completely. The steering kind of "locked up" and the engine revved much more than it should have. Instead of going round the corner, it kind of went straight on, clipping an oncoming sedan. My reaction was to swerve more to the right and thus get off the road, but instead of a hard shoulder there was an embankment, and with no real control over steering or throttle I bounced off that and sideswiped an oncoming SUV. That sent me more or less off the road to the right, albeit still blocking half the lane. I couldn't move it.

The radio was still working (I turned it off, suddenly not in the mood for whatever the heck I was listening to) but the hazards wouldn't go on. I put it in park (griiiiinnndd) and turned the car off. At this point I was pretty shaken up. Please note I have a severe anxiety disorder AND have never been involved in an accident. Anybody who's ever lost control of a car at speed will probably understand why I was kind of freaking out at this point.

The police (who arrived oddly quickly) were very understanding, which surprised me. Everyone in all three cars was unharmed. No airbags deployed anywhere, including all 10 in my Spark. I somehow gave the Volvo SUV a flat tire, so it got towed away with mine. I'm not sure how they moved my car, though, since every gear was neutral. The officer pushed it back onto a driveway, or tried anyway, which is why I'd put it in neutral. It kept rolling in park, so I put on the handbrake.

There wasn't much external damage. Front left quarter panel and front bumper looked banged up, and for some reason the rear bumper had come detached. Doors were fine. Left headlamp and taillight assemblies were smashed, as was my left mirror.

As I found out today, it's totaled.

The front suspension and transaxle are what did it in. As I suspected, body damage would have been repairable easily. According to the head mechanic (at a place we know and trust), the hidden damage was all too much. He sent me a 10-page estimate that came out to over $9000.

I'm going to be talking with insurance later today, but figured I'd post here first. See, the car is still under warranty and I have GM's protection plan to boot. As far as I'm concerned, this was a complete mechanical failure that caused me to lose control and crash. Nobody - police, insurance, whomever - is officially saying it's the collision that broke the suspension and transmission.

This is all new to me. How do I pursue this under warranty? Have I even got a chance? The car just failed catastrophically at speed, but it's effectively my word against their's (GM's).

It would help to hear other stories about failed or problematic steering racks / transaxles / auto transmissions / suspensions with the 2013 (or any) Spark...way too much going through my head right now to know what to say and to whom. GM's warranty is confusing to me. I have my protection plan ID card thingy right here, and of course all the original paperwork from purchasing the car, but...I never expected it to total itself.

Sorry for the long message. Thanks for any insight you can provide.

[leighmaxwell 6]

Wow that sounds scary. I hope someone has ideas for you. Glad no one was hurt.

[Retired old Gearhead 201]

If this accident was indeed caused by a vehicle failure and not your driving, well, first off, put all your best recollections on paper and be sure the insurance company is informed of these details. They can have the chip that records the cars functions just prior to the incident examined and if the car was at fault liability shifts to the manufacturer and a possible lawsuit against GM for all damage, etc. Insurance companies have excellent lawyers. That IMO is your first step.

[nullcoding@gmail.com 3]

Chip? First I've heard of that...!

I have to go to body shop TODAY and clean it out, take the plates, etc. Gonna take plenty of photos too. It's my first car and I'm going to miss it terribly. So many good memories.

BUT. If they're taking it to the salvage yard tomorrow, as my claims adjuster has arranged, how do I go about getting this "chip" examined? I can ask the guys at the shop but they're likely fairly busy.

As your tagline says, my Spark is indeed broken, but I maintain that I'm not at fault. Nobody's said I am, either (phew). In my official recorded statement to USAA, I made it quite clear that the vehicle was at fault due to a sudden mechanical failure at speed, and the body shop's estimate supports that conclusion, albeit with only parts lists and raw figures. Get this - labour alone was over half the quote, estimated at roughly 100 man-hours...and their rates are respectably affordable, too!

As far as I can tell, the police have informed the other two drivers that my car lost control, because nobody has been calling me (I authorised release of my contact information to the other drivers) and I've not been questioned or anything. To be frank, I have no idea how this all works. I've never been in an accident, and this one was very scary.

As a "male" under 25, I'm up against practically irrefutable statistics saying "we" cause more accidents than any other demographic, but I suppose it works in my favour I was driving a high-visibility stock hatchback with double-digit horsepower at the speed limit. Maybe slower.

Fun fact: this is the second Chevrolet that USAA and this particular body shop have totaled for my family within the last month alone...! Last one was the TrailBlazer - that was my brother's fault. We have a problem with trees and Chevy trucks on our driveway...

It's all getting very overwhelming, as I'm sure you can understand. You might be a retired old gearhead, but I'm still an unemployed young...person with a limited working knowledge of cars. I'm not ignorant - not at all - but my father raised a good point last night when I was talking with him about this. He told me not to sign or do anything without a lawyer present, including notarising the I-351 release forms and all. Mentioned getting a "corporate lawyer" for purposes of going up against GM. THAT sounds scary to me, especially coming from my father, who as a rule isn't exactly fond of lawyers...

Oh and did I mention I'm job-hunting? On the off-chance I DO get a call back from someplace someday soon-ish, I've no idea how I'll show up. Over-thinking much? XD

One thing's for sure - I am likely NOT getting another Spark, nor will I be purchasing something with an automatic transmission made by Daewoo. I'm looking at a manual Sonic. The Trax seems interesting enough, but isn't that kind of just...a Spark/Sonic hybrid crossover thingy with the same 1,4L engine (plus turbo) on a higher chassis...? :P

[Ray Dockrey 97]

The only issue is having to prove that several of the car's systems failed at the same time. A transmission failure wouldn't have caused you to lose the steering. You said that even in park it would roll so the wheels weren't locked up and you didn't say anything about not being able to turn the wheels after the accident.

You could have had an electrical issue that would have caused you to lose power steering since the power steering in these cars use an electrical motor. It is still steerable but requires lots of effort. That could be why it felt that it had semi locked up. But that wouldn't have cause the transmission to fail.

The real issue is not getting GM to fix it. Its getting GM to replace it. Its already been decided that it is totaled. You can get an accident lawyer, and they will have to get an independent study on the car to see what failed and when it failed. Whether all that is worth it is up to you. If a lawyer takes it will be another issue since there is no money to be made off of injuries since no one was injured.

Since the car is not real expensive and no one was hurt it may be better to just take the settlement from the insurance and move on since there is no telling how long it could be tied up in litigation over a car that isn't worth much in the first place.

[nullcoding@gmail.com 3]

...the power steering in these cars use an electrical motor. It is still steerable but requires lots of effort. That could be why it felt that it had semi locked up. But that wouldn't have cause the transmission to fail...

...it may be better to just take the settlement from the insurance and move on since there is no telling how long it could be tied up in litigation over a car that isn't worth much in the first place.

Thank you for your input. I appreciate it!

USAA was very generous (as they are wont to be) with their estimate of the car's value. Even in its present condition, they put it just about $1K under the TrailBlazer they totaled last month, and that was still technically completely driveable!!

That said, I still had payments on the car. Quite a lot, as it turns out lol. I'm gonna end up with a cheque for around USD 1700, which isn't terrible, but that'll be my money and the loan will be paid off and all. Whatever. I accept this is reality and s*** happens to those who least deserve it.

I don't want it fixed. The unibody is compromised for all I know. I'm no engineer, but I know a few, and the UHSS pillars and such that comprise the Spark's fundamental structure may have sustained some serious (albeit possibly invisible) damage from the steering and such failing.

You raise another good point with regards to the steering. I imagine there was an electrical failure involved. Months ago, I had the PCV valve recall addressed up in Rhode Island. They said something about the computer having to "re-learn the idle" twice, which is why the service took a bit longer than expected. Then as I mentioned, the hazards didn't go on at the time of the collision.

I could turn the wheels, which I may not have made totally clear. It just seems that at speed, without power steering, my (laughable) physical strength alone was not enough to actually keep the car on the road. That makes sense. Thanks for that insight.

USAA decided it was worth a decent amount more than I expected. I don't know what to do about litigation. You're absolutely right in that it may well be too much effort...no doubt about that. =/

[Gossamer 50]

You mentioned that when you shifted into Park you heard (or felt) a "griiiiinnndd", so I have to ask, was the car still moving when you shifted to Park?

[nullcoding@gmail.com 3]

No. I have always been very gentle with this car. It was fully stopped at the time.

[WaltK 305]

The real issue is not getting GM to fix it. Its getting GM to replace it. Its already been decided that it is totaled. You can get an accident lawyer, and they will have to get an independent study on the car to see what failed and when it failed. Whether all that is worth it is up to you. If a lawyer takes it will be another issue since there is no money to be made off of injuries since no one was injured.

Since the car is not real expensive and no one was hurt it may be better to just take the settlement from the insurance and move on since there is no telling how long it could be tied up in litigation over a car that isn't worth much in the first place.

Great advice! This is probably the best course to follow, keep the group informed as to how things work out. Good luck!

[Retired old Gearhead 201]

Have you told the insurance people it was the car that failed? $1,700 is not enough for you, but I'm sure the insurance co is happy with that.

Two choices: take the money or call a lawyer as the data chip will prove your case and may result in GM giving you another Spark or cash because if it was a vehicle failure..GM would want to wrap this up without any bad press. More effort, but just talking to a lawyer does not hurt and maybe get some moral etc support from your dad.

When I came back from 'Nam and suffered from PTSD the gov't gave us vets some money to get us back on our feet and I foolishly used the money to buy an over powered Firebird which I promptly crashed, being young and inexperienced driver and I remember how stressful that was, so, ya..I can understand your situation, but $1,700 is not enough for what happened with your car..at least talk to a lawyer and mention the data chip that records what happened just prior to the accident...K?

[Ray Dockrey 97]

The issue is that there is no injury. You can't make money off the car. The car is only paid at what it is worth. Nothing more. The first thing a lawyer is going to do is send you to a doctor or injury clinic to start racking up medical bills. Thats where the money is. Thats where the lawyer makes his money. He has already made it clear that he wasn't injured so there is no money to be made there.

So now its either fight GM to make them give you another car or at least pay you the value of the car or take the insurance money and move on. It sounds like to me the $1700 was what was left over after the payoff of the car. You also have to take in consideration what his deductible was. A higher deductible means less in his pocket.

Between my two boys I have been through three totaled cars all being their fault. One of them was an injury accident where the lady claimed she was injured and got a lawyer. The insurance company paid on her car in three weeks time. It took five years to settle on the injury claims. The lawyer made no money on the payoff of the car. That was never argued. He made is money on the injury claims.

Edited April 24, 2015 by Ray Dockrey

[nullcoding@gmail.com 3]

"It sounds like to me the $1700 was what was left over after the payoff of the car"

That is correct. The vehicle itself was valued (as salvage titled) at $11.870,78. I was making very small payments because I'm not in the best financial situation right now. Well, that's an understatement. I'm unemployed. -.- It sucks.

I cleaned it out yesterday and asked about the data chip thing. They said it'll be investigated at the salvage yard, to which I plan on going anyway. I took about two hundred photos, inside and out, including several videos. Mostly sentimental - this was my first car and I now have six days to replace it before I have to start paying for the rental out-of-pocket. I won't even get this payout until I and the co-owner sign and notarise the I-351s, which will take a further 3-4 business days to process, so at the moment, I'm more or less out of luck.

There were no injuries. This was a mechanical failure. The suspension seems to have given out completely. I assume that took the gearbox with it. I'm just going off the estimate paperwork from the body shop.

I won't be signing anything nor speaking with the other insurance company without an attorney present.

Should note that of the two other cars involved, one was a dealer loaner insured by USAA, which is also my insurer. That should pose no problem, I hope.

Interesting PTSD should be mentioned. I have that as well, from numerous other incidents, but this accident thing isn't helping. I'm actually surprised I still feel comfortable driving, especially given the rental I have is this massive Dodge Charger. I honestly don't think I'll go for another Spark, though. Plus, the 2016 version looks like a Fiesta. No thanks.

[Ray Dockrey 97]

You won't have to talk to the other insurance company. Since this was your fault your insurance company handles everything. If they do get a lawyer then you will have the choice of getting your own lawyer or the insurance company will assign one to you. Of course laws are different across states but generally that's how it works. You won't be involved with anything.

That's how it worked with us. The lady got a lawyer, and when we were notified of it then I just let our insurance company handle it who was State farm. They assigned us a lawyer, who was very good, and him and his team handled things through out the five years.

Here is where you can find info about the event recorder.

http://www.harristechnical.com/

Edited April 24, 2015 by Ray Dockrey

[nullcoding@gmail.com 3]

What makes you say this was my fault? I've been saying consistently that it is not.

Ordinarily that would be meaningless, but the responding officer said as much (I should have been wired lol) and USAA has not used the word "fault" at all since the tenth when this occurred.

Nobody's out to get me. Perhaps I didn't make that clear. There were no injuries and thus nothing over which anybody could sue me.

I firmly maintain the collision occurred as a result of complete mechanical failure on the car's part. not driver error. I have a perfectly clean driving record - as in, not so much as a speeding ticket; let alone a crash - and although I'm a male under 25, I know my rights and I most certainly know what happened (or didn't happen) in the moments leading up to this accident.

You are correct in that I don't have to talk to Allstate, or indeed to anybody. I have enough friends (or parents of friends) in the legal field to know the best course of action is to keep my mouth shut regardless, full stop.

[Angrybird12 61]

There is a crash data recorder that is supposed freeze all the information at the time of the crash as to the operating conditions of the car at just before and after the impact. Unfortunately I think it will only work when an airbag is activated. Since you said no airbags went off the impact must not have been severe enough so imdoubt the data was frozen. Your insurance company should insist on downloading the data if possible and if the information is there it should provide proof that it was a failure in the car.

Glad nobody was hurt, cars can be replaced.

Edited May 1, 2015 by Angrybird12

[Ray Dockrey 97]

And just to add, if your insurance company is paying off like it sounds then you are at fault. There is no way around it.

[nullcoding@gmail.com 3]

An independent mechanic took a look and said the left front ball joint had uncoupled. That would certainly explain why the wheels are pointing in different directions and why I lost control of the vehicle. It felt like I'd lost power steering, but more likely I just couldn't steer because the ball joint wasn't doing its job.

There's no reason for that to happen on a car not even two years old. None. Never hit a giant pothole, never crashed, hit anything, whatever.

Shoddy build quality? I don't know. I need to hear more from other Spark owners. I can't find much about Spark / Matiz ball joint issues, but I disagree with there being "no way around it." As a male under the age of 25, it's just easier for all parties to say it's my fault. I don't know about who's paying whom. It's all a bit confusing.

I just know the car's got a warranty for a reason.

[Angrybird12 61]

Isn't it possible the suspension and transaxel damage occurred as a result of the accident instead of being the cause of the accident?

[Ray Dockrey 97]

I agree with Angry. The damage very well could have come from you hitting the embankment or the other vehicle. You would have to prove otherwise. And again, if your insurance has paid off on everybody then as far as they are concerned you are at fault. You would have to prove that the car was at fault and then make GM pay back your insurance company.

You may not like that and you may not think it's fair but that is how it works. If they pay off then they are accepting fault which means you are at fault as far as they are concerned.

[nullcoding@gmail.com 3]

USAA paid me because my car was insured by them, and it stopped working and was damaged beyond repair as a result. It wouldn't make sense for the other peoples' insurance to pay me. If nobody was coming the other direction, I may not have crashed at all.

Riddle me this, then. If all this damage came from hitting the other vehicles (in between which I bounced off the rocky embankment), then why did I lose control in the first place? Something went very, very wrong. I am not a reckless driver. Add to that the fact I know this road very well and always drive the speed limit (as it's a curvy, twisty sort of back road), and I can't see where anybody could get off saying the mechanical failure was caused by the crash instead of the other way round.

Even if I had a dash cam, that would not be sufficient to prove I was driving responsibly. I understand it's my word against theirs, or in this case, GM's. I can't think of any other explanations for losing control around a corner.

Plus - the other two cars were fine. The first one drove away within minutes, and the second had only a flat tire. Is the Spark really so poorly built that an arguably minor collision (remember, no airbags deployed etc) would cause over $9K of damage?!

[Gossamer 50]

Don't get too caught up with what anyone here (including me) tells you.

We were not there, we did not witness the accident, nor did we see the car after the accident.

All any of us can do is speak from our own experiences - or out our asses.

That being said, in my experience no one (not even your own insurance) really cares what caused the accident if no one was injured.

It is chalked up to being an everyday traffic accident, and the insurance pays for the damages - and you will probably take a hit in your insurance premiums (don't get me started on insurance companies - they are scum ).

You may have a case against GM because the airbags didn't deploy in an accident that totaled* the car, however since as you said the other cars had no real damage and no one (especially you) was injured in the accident, it will be a hard sell.

That will depend on your lawyer and how the accident was investigated.

GM will argue (rightly or wrongly) that since there was little damage to the other vehicles, you were not going fast enough for the airbags to deploy, and the fact that you weren't injured, proves that the airbags weren't needed.

Cars today are designed to crumple in an accident to absorb the energy of the crash to keep it from being transmitted to the passengers, and looking from the outside in with the little information I have, it sounds to me like that is what happened.

I know it sucks that you lost your car and that you are being blamed for an accident that you say wasn't your fault, but unfortunately, that is the way insurance works , and without injuries or massive property damage, everyone has been paid so the case is really pretty much over.

*When a car is declared "totaled" by an insurance company, 99% of the time it does not mean that the car can't be repaired. All it really means is that it would cost the insurance company more than they want to pay to fix it.

[Retired old Gearhead 201]

Jaska said: "An independent mechanic took a look and said the left front ball joint had uncoupled. That would certainly explain why the wheels are pointing in different directions and why I lost control of the vehicle. It felt like I'd lost power steering, but more likely I just couldn't steer because the ball joint wasn't doing its job".

Here's the thing: without the data on the chip that records the last 30 seconds before impact there is no proof of anything and the accident is then the drivers fault. Insurance examines your car, decides they don't want to pay for the repairs and then buys your car for the book value they have listed in their insurance 'blue book' type thing. Once both parties agree on the price and papers are signed with title transferred to to the insurance co. a check is issued to the previous owner (you). Once this is done and the check is cashed the entire obligation of your ins. co. is met and case closed.

A lawyer and the chip data prior to settlement of the claim could have had much different outcome, with GM possibly becoming involved if the data showed mechanical error rather than driver error. It is possible that the vehicle failed prior to the collision and was the cause..but the bottom line is this was not proven, the insurance settled and, legally, that is the end of this sad story. It's over so best not to dwell on what could have been and just chalk it up to one of the many life experiences you can learn from. You may have some anxiety over this whole episode, but bottom line is no one was injured, no one is suing you and a car can be replaced anytime you want with a brand new ownership experience. If a new car is not in your budget, you can enjoy some time searching for a used car and the joy of negotiating a price so low you feel like a winner..You got my drift...Right?

[Angrybird12 61]

Going off your description I will still say from my experience from an accident my son had that was similar to this but did not involve other cars, the transaxle and suspension damage were the result of the impact, most likely from hitting the embankment and not the other cars. Now what caused you to lose control in the first place is nothing I want to speculate on.

[nullcoding@gmail.com 3]

A lawyer and the chip data prior to settlement of the claim could have had much different outcome, with GM possibly becoming involved if the data showed mechanical error rather than driver error. It is possible that the vehicle failed prior to the collision and was the cause..but the bottom line is this was not proven, the insurance settled and, legally, that is the end of this sad story.

Correct. Or at least, that would be the case if I'd actually signed the I-351s and given over the title. I've not, and as such the case is still open.

From reading all these replies, it's looking more and more like this won't be worth pursuing much longer. The rental is starting to cost us quite a bit, and it's not a very nice car at that. I thought the Spark had bad AC, but this Charger is about as weak and honestly feels more underpowered than the Spark did (and this is a 292hp V6).

I know it's going to be difficult to prove anything. I've just yet to hear anything about the chip data, that's all. I know we're in the process of investigating it.

This is taking so long mostly because we just totaled our other Chevrolet (a loaded 2008 TrailBlazer LT) back in March and replaced it with a brand-new Murano, which obviously wasn't cheap, and now I also have to repair our refrigerator...all whilst searching for decent used cars in the area. Yikes.

I imagine if we'd not totaled the TrailBlazer, losing my Spark would be a bit less of a hit. The emotional side of it has passed, though, luckily. My first car :( I only hope whatever I wind up with can be made almost as unique. I don't want a boring economy car. I certainly miss getting 38 MPG, I can tell ya that much...

[Ray Dockrey 97]

I don't think there is any data to be read from the data recorder because the air bags didn't go off. From my research on them the data freezes when the air bags deploy. If the air bags don't deploy then it continues to write over the data. it only records three to fives seconds then writes over the existing data.